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Author Topic: ECCA - fraud or foe?  (Read 6326 times)

antalp

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2012, 10:38:46 AM »

I'm sorry to disagree but retailers cant and shouldn't be allowed within 1000 miles of a Consumers Association. There is a very clear distinct conflict of interests.

Most business sectors are littered with horror stories where profits have been pursued so vigorously that the consumer has been forgotten entirely. On most ocassions its taken some serious legislation to solve that.

Do you really want union reps from the management ranks ? Health & Safety officials subsidised by those responsible for cutting costs ? I could go on (and often do lol)

If they want to represent the Consumer.....just do so

You have a very good and fair point.  Getting in with retailers is not the ideal at all and there will be conflicts.  If part of ECCA's agenda is about consumers rights above retailers then, yes, my idea is stupid, I did not realise that.  Apologies, it never occurred to me, I kind of saw them as interconnected.    No retailers, no users , no users, no retailers.
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diz

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #16 on: December 01, 2012, 10:40:05 AM »

My addiction seems to override my principles here, like it did when I smoked. The same thing currently goes for newsagents and supermarkets, so don't feel what I said was a personal dig - only a reason I decided not to do what you're considering.

The point about the questionable moral view (one where I admit I considered doing what you are myself) is separate from the point I made about the conflict of interest between vendors and customers.

Personally - as part of my own research in evaluating possible products I'd sell - I've encountered so many of them seem to be faulty in some way. There is an incredible turnover in the current marketplace as products are "improved" and revised. There also seems to be an over-riding fanaticism about certain products that belittles any justified criticism of them. Many vendors don't seem to know really what they're selling and what any health implications might be.

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antalp

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2012, 10:58:47 AM »

Hi Diz - I have wrangled the safety implications over and over in my head.  I cannot do harm to anyone and I can only judge the situation on my experience.  I was a pathetic smoker, unable to stop for over 30 years.  Ecigs changed that.  I don't know if they are safe, in fact they cannot be as safe as not doing it.  But I do 100% believe it is safer than smoking and every smoker I can convert to ecigs will be better off on ecigs than smoking.  I am designing my website and it states explicitly and clearly that ecigs should only be used as an alternative to smoking and that basically if the user is not a current smoker then they are not permitted to buy. 

How can I possibly go through all the scenario's , - Perhaps upon reflection I can agree with the BMA, if ecigs never existed maybe people are more likely to do the utterly safe thing and stop altogether.  But maybe if ecigs never existed yet even more people would carry on smoking.  For me a business is not about the money, I am fortunate in my day job already, I just really believe ecigs can kick the tobacco industry where it hurts.
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diz

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #18 on: December 01, 2012, 11:22:21 AM »

Hi Diz - I have wrangled the safety implications over and over in my head.  I cannot do harm to anyone and I can only judge the situation on my experience.  I was a pathetic smoker, unable to stop for over 30 years.  Ecigs changed that.  I don't know if they are safe, in fact they cannot be as safe as not doing it.  But I do 100% believe it is safer than smoking and every smoker I can convert to ecigs will be better off on ecigs than smoking.  I am designing my website and it states explicitly and clearly that ecigs should only be used as an alternative to smoking and that basically if the user is not a current smoker then they are not permitted to buy. 

How can I possibly go through all the scenario's , - Perhaps upon reflection I can agree with the BMA, if ecigs never existed maybe people are more likely to do the utterly safe thing and stop altogether.  But maybe if ecigs never existed yet even more people would carry on smoking.  For me a business is not about the money, I am fortunate in my day job already, I just really believe ecigs can kick the tobacco industry where it hurts.

You are preaching to the converted here. As an ex-heavy smoker for over 30 years myself (30+ a day high tar cigs and heavy unfiltered "jazz woodbine" usage) I completely understand the ease with which vaping can replace a compulsion. I still do wonder abut any medical benefits because, for me, the damage to my lungs has already been done if I'm honest.

If your business is not about the money, then you will have a perfect opportunity to undercut everyone else in the market and offer some charity service to us all! I'm only being envious about your willingness to seize an opportunity in an emerging market that I felt unable to.
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itsmeitis

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #19 on: December 01, 2012, 11:27:32 AM »

i'd like to pick up on a couple of points:

"ECCA appeals as it seems to mirror how I feel.  I despise tobacco companies and even the NRT industry.  That happened when I noticed NRT products marketed to people who had not taken nicotine in months, trying to lure them back into the nicotine trap."

despising tobacco is one thing, but as it is they who shall eventually own e-cigs, quite naive ... additionaly, for all their good, e-cigs do infact keep us tied to a permanent addiction.

"However I also intend to open an Ecig retail business because I love the product so much."

as do many, however we can still love and enjoy the product without desire to take it to personal profit.

"I have already made a donation to ECCA as a personal user but I was planning so so through a business channel.  This thread is tarnishing that idea."

although it not impossible, it has always been difficult to polish a turd.

"No retailers, no users , no users, no retailers."

nor what anyone seeks. not us, not them, not tobacco company.
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ukric

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ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2012, 11:57:21 AM »

Was it a large donation? I'm curious as to whether it bought any champagne for the AGM.... come to think of it, not heard from any of them for a while, perhaps they're sunning themselves ;)
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justin case

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2012, 12:00:27 PM »

Was it a large donation? I'm curious as to whether it bought any champagne for the AGM.... come to think of it, not heard from any of them for a while, perhaps they're sunning themselves ;)

sam bought some new laces,  so he can lace up and get out there.
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itsmeitis

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2012, 12:02:38 PM »

sam bought some new laces,  so he can lace up and get out there.

 :o

Sam couldn't tie his own shoelaces ... :P
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