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Author Topic: ECCA - fraud or foe?  (Read 6020 times)

itsmeitis

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ECCA - fraud or foe?
« on: November 29, 2012, 02:14:07 PM »

where have they gone and what have they been doing ...

as a consumer and keen attendant of ECCA meetings where held in the freely provided video chat room, i have noticed a few notable discrepancies ...

1.) - ECCA claim finances are tight thus hindered, yet they fail even to utilize the provision of the freely provided chat room from which they no longer even bother to hold meetings.
2.) - ECCA by very virtue of its existence claim consumer representation, yet consumers continue to express difficulty in reaching even any reps.
3.) - even where one might be found the reps express lack of knowledge as to what are current state of affairs.
4.) - in event a "news" institution requires plant for interview, ECCA call upon consumers as if they suddenly remember those do exist.
5.) - "Don't complain about us not doing something IF YOU AREN'T HELPING  -  you're part of the problem, not the solution" ... that's their motto
6.) - ECCA remain firm on rejecting, even perhaps attacking pharmaceutical input, yet run strait there and present in order to enforce their own objectives.
7.) - ECCA seem not to have grasp that they are repeatedly misleading consumers and a wider public, alike.

i also wonder why their ECCA forum requires locking out from prying eyes ...

"Our members demand their right to be heard, and we will ensure that their voice is heard" ... bold as that statement seems, its not something i have yet seen note of.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2012, 02:59:40 PM by itsmeitis »
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emtronea

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2012, 10:26:47 PM »

i think ecca has died and its now a pipe bomb dream  ???
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SC_Sammy

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2012, 06:16:53 AM »

Humm, sure sounds like they have lost direction. To fight for vaping rights, it's going to take money and lots of it. Seems a focused ECCA would work with Vendors especially for fund raising since their lively hood is at stake. But if the ECCA does not open their forums, I'd be also wary of donating too.
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james116

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2012, 10:18:19 AM »

Interesting... t'is a shame they don't step up and at least attempt the good they could really do. I'm sure vendors would be happy to aid in fund raising or donations and such.
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justin case

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2012, 10:29:44 AM »

Interesting... t'is a shame they don't step up and at least attempt the good they could really do. I'm sure vendors would be happy to aid in fund raising or donations and such.
and what good could they actually do?....they simply are not needed...the e-cig world has changed since the idea of ECCA was formed...for months now they have been running round like headless chickens, desperately trying to find a reason for their very existence, but alas they cant.
and if they got funds from vendors that would compromise their thin veneer of being a consumers organisation....the thing is dead mate, and all the good will in the world wont change that.
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itsmeitis

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2012, 10:32:23 AM »

Humm, sure sounds like they have lost direction. To fight for vaping rights, it's going to take money and lots of it. Seems a focused ECCA would work with Vendors especially for fund raising since their lively hood is at stake. But if the ECCA does not open their forums, I'd be also wary of donating too.

you may be thinking ECITA ... they are seemingly flourishing unchallenged.  they have copious amount of money. even too excess if their expressed ability to sue is anything to gauge things by.
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lazydog

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2012, 01:00:41 PM »

Over 24 hrs ago now (night before last) a conversation started in chat on VTTV with reference to ECCA and all the new vapers not being aware of the existence even of ECCA.
Sam was there and knew about this, I stated in chat I would post on various forums which I have.I have contacted Sam on FB even though I hate using FB on the 3 forums I
posted on, not one single committee member has joined in.Only on here has Fiona offered any help so when they say again they have no support it could be because they
never bother accepting it.
As is said in a TV program "I am out"   
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itsmeitis

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2012, 01:10:20 PM »

at least you too can now also appreciate some of the escalated discontent and disillusionment.

best way to get response, is by being the bloke whom blogs unfounded pro ECITA type articles and also flogs e-cigs ... he often finds their favoured ear. ;)
« Last Edit: November 30, 2012, 01:25:17 PM by itsmeitis »
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SC_Sammy

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2012, 02:37:45 PM »

....they simply are not needed...the e-cig world has changed since the idea of ECCA was formed...
....the thing is dead mate, and all the good will in the world wont change that.
You are probably right. With my mods. & rebuildables, I could be pretty much self sufficient even with a ban or heavy tax.
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spyder

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2012, 08:52:35 PM »

with reference to ECCA and all the new vapers not being aware of the existence even of ECCA.

Been vaping from almost the start, never heard of ECCA. Who are they, what do they do?

At the beginning every man and his dog was looking at a way to pounce onto the e-cig bandwagon and make a few quid. I was even going to have a punt myself.

After a short time away from the vaping community I came back to have a look around. It was around the time that one UK retailer was having, let's say "mental health issues". Along with this were rumours posted about organizations that had control over flavourings and whether a company got a flavour or not was down to them.

Anyway.

TLDR version.

Fill cart/carto or tank, attach to battery device and vape. I don't think us vapers really need any organizations to vape. Unless I've missed something?
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antalp

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2012, 08:48:29 AM »

I joined this forum specifically to find out more about ECCA and I must say I am shocked at this thread and lack of response.

First and foremost I am a vaper, it is the best thing that has happened to me after the damage smoking has done.  ECCA appeals as it seems to mirror how I feel.  I despise tobacco companies and even the NRT industry.  That happened when I noticed NRT products marketed to people who had not taken nicotine in months, trying to lure them back into the nicotine trap.

However I also intend to open an Ecig retail business because I love the product so much.  I have already made a donation to ECCA as a personal user but I was planning so so through a business channel.  This thread is tarnishing that idea.  I have researched ECITA and I have no doubt they do good work, however they represent maybe 18 retailers or about 5-10% of those out there.  The reason is probably due to the exorbitant price they charge.  £7200 per year.  In my business life I have dealt with a few associations of world renown and the fee's  range from £1k-£3k. 

My first impression (and forgive me if I speak with ignorance or lack of knowledge) is that if ECCA is having difficulties growing or financial problems, as this thread suggests, it should expand its purpose to cover retailers as well.  Retailers are not the enemy of vapers and are often started by its keenest advocates.  The advantage to covering retailers as well are numerous:-

1) Will have influence over retailers for the benefit of consumers with association policies.
2) Retailers are happy to pay £1-£3k per year for membership and there are probably at least 100 unsupported retailers
3) Retailers work full time and are the most likely to be willing to help to protect their business and vaping in general
4) By having retailers on board they can promote ECCA through their websites and form a link to users.  Retailers will proudly display association logo's and links
5) It is retailers who will donate the most and fight the hardest as they are users and their livelihood is at stake.

My greatest wish is that by 2030 cigarette smokers are rare as pipe or snuff users today.  Ecigs will be the norm.  Ideally there will be no nicotine use at all, but I have to be somewhat realistic.  I will do everything I can do to help and I was aiming to sponsor / donate to ECCA anyway.  But if this is how people feel about ECCA...................maybe they should rename to ECCRA with the R representing retailers.


« Last Edit: December 01, 2012, 08:50:39 AM by antalp »
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igetcha

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ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2012, 09:58:32 AM »

I joined this forum specifically to find out more about ECCA and I must say I am shocked at this thread and lack of response.

First and foremost I am a vaper, it is the best thing that has happened to me after the damage smoking has done.  ECCA appeals as it seems to mirror how I feel.  I despise tobacco companies and even the NRT industry.  That happened when I noticed NRT products marketed to people who had not taken nicotine in months, trying to lure them back into the nicotine trap.

However I also intend to open an Ecig retail business because I love the product so much.  I have already made a donation to ECCA as a personal user but I was planning so so through a business channel.  This thread is tarnishing that idea.  I have researched ECITA and I have no doubt they do good work, however they represent maybe 18 retailers or about 5-10% of those out there.  The reason is probably due to the exorbitant price they charge.  £7200 per year.  In my business life I have dealt with a few associations of world renown and the fee's  range from £1k-£3k. 

My first impression (and forgive me if I speak with ignorance or lack of knowledge) is that if ECCA is having difficulties growing or financial problems, as this thread suggests, it should expand its purpose to cover retailers as well.  Retailers are not the enemy of vapers and are often started by its keenest advocates.  The advantage to covering retailers as well are numerous:-

1) Will have influence over retailers for the benefit of consumers with association policies.
2) Retailers are happy to pay £1-£3k per year for membership and there are probably at least 100 unsupported retailers
3) Retailers work full time and are the most likely to be willing to help to protect their business and vaping in general
4) By having retailers on board they can promote ECCA through their websites and form a link to users.  Retailers will proudly display association logo's and links
5) It is retailers who will donate the most and fight the hardest as they are users and their livelihood is at stake.

My greatest wish is that by 2030 cigarette smokers are rare as pipe or snuff users today.  Ecigs will be the norm.  Ideally there will be no nicotine use at all, but I have to be somewhat realistic.  I will do everything I can do to help and I was aiming to sponsor / donate to ECCA anyway.  But if this is how people feel about ECCA...................maybe they should rename to ECCRA with the R representing retailers.

Hi mate,

You have got ECCA mixed up with ECITA.......they are two very different entities ;)
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diz

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #12 on: December 01, 2012, 10:10:09 AM »

Seems to me like a combined trade and consumer association would have a conflict of interests.

Good luck with your intended business and in profiteering from the addicted.
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antalp

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2012, 10:20:10 AM »

Seems to me like a combined trade and consumer association would have a conflict of interests.

Good luck with your intended business and in profiteering from the addicted.

LOL - thank you for your kind words, except with that logic there would be no electronic cigarettes available for anyone.  Perhaps, if your principles are strong enough you should boycott all ecig manufacturers and retailers until it was manufactured on a non profit basis by a charity.   Good luck with that.
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Derek

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Re: ECCA - fraud or foe?
« Reply #14 on: December 01, 2012, 10:28:12 AM »

I'm sorry to disagree but retailers cant and shouldn't be allowed within 1000 miles of a Consumers Association. There is a very clear distinct conflict of interests.

Most business sectors are littered with horror stories where profits have been pursued so vigorously that the consumer has been forgotten entirely. On most ocassions its taken some serious legislation to solve that.

Do you really want union reps from the management ranks ? Health & Safety officials subsidised by those responsible for cutting costs ? I could go on (and often do lol)

If they want to represent the Consumer.....just do so
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